• JackGreenEarth@lemm.ee
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    1
    ·
    7 days ago

    So can I clarify that when you’re saying

    Some people take the existence of god as a brute fact

    That you mean

    Some people assume that universe was created by something

    ?

    • Opinionhaver@feddit.uk
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      1
      ·
      7 days ago

      Well, that’s not a direct quote from me, but yes - some people assume the universe was created by something. For some, that’s the person running the simulation; for others, it’s the biblical God as described in the Bible, or atleast their interpretation of it.

      • JackGreenEarth@lemm.ee
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        2
        ·
        7 days ago

        So if I’m understanding you correctly it’s not just that people believe the universe was created by something, but they have a specific idea of what that thing is - eg a conscious, powerful, morally good, knowledgeable being

          • JackGreenEarth@lemm.ee
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            1
            ·
            edit-2
            7 days ago

            Ok, now I’ve clarified what beliefs you think some people assume without evidence, I would still say that believing those things isn’t right. You should still have a good reason for believing what you believe, and taking the existence of a conscious creator as given is invalid.

            • Opinionhaver@feddit.uk
              link
              fedilink
              English
              arrow-up
              1
              ·
              7 days ago

              By “those things,” you’re referring to God or the entity running the simulation? Whether it’s a reasonable belief isn’t really relevant from the perspective of the theory itself. You’re still going to encounter people who hold such beliefs - and if you want to change their minds, the better approach is to identify and challenge their underlying beliefs, rather than the ones built on top of them.

              Belief in a God or a creator is a foundational belief - being against abortion isn’t. That view only logically follows from the prior belief.

              • JackGreenEarth@lemm.ee
                link
                fedilink
                English
                arrow-up
                2
                ·
                7 days ago

                Someone can have a fundamental belief that they shouldn’t have.

                Someone can also have a derivative belief from another derivative belief, without the prior belief having to be fundamental.

                • Opinionhaver@feddit.uk
                  link
                  fedilink
                  English
                  arrow-up
                  1
                  ·
                  7 days ago

                  Whether they should or shouldn’t hold those beliefs is not an objective fact but a value judgment on your part - and either way, it’s entirely unrelated to what I was saying.